#archlinux32 | Logs for 2022-01-16

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[08:12:48] <horo> hello is anyone on?
[08:13:37] <horo> I posted a question earlier but got disconnected and do not know if the question was answered
[08:15:07] <horo> namely how do i get new keys for Erich Eckner
[08:15:21] <horo> so pacman starts working again
[08:48:40] <KitsuWhooa> I don't really know but I'm sure they'll be around to help. I assume you've tried manually downloading the archlinux32-keyring package and installing it with pacman -U?
[09:06:54] <horo> i've tried using pacman-keys --refresh-keys but get an error about dimngr
[09:09:05] <horo> where would the archlinux32-keyring be located?
[09:13:11] <horo> i ran pacman -S archlinux32-keyring followed by pacman -Syu and it seems to be working now
[09:13:14] <horo> thank you
[09:16:21] <horo> what is archlinux32-keyring? is it just an upto date list of public keys for signing? and is it not installed by defualt on a new build?
[09:19:14] <KitsuWhooa> glad to hear that fixed it!
[09:19:27] <KitsuWhooa> It should be installed by default
[09:19:58] <KitsuWhooa> Typically there's a new version of it by the time the keys have expired, so if you update your system frequently enough, this shouldn't happen
[09:28:09] <horo> I'll set it to cron then, thank you
[09:30:18] <horo> on a different topic, is there a different AUR repo for archlinux32?
[09:30:59] <horo> I want to try fbterm but it doesn't seem to be in the defualt repos
[09:31:55] <KitsuWhooa> Last I checked, you download the pkgbuild and manually add your architecture to build it
[09:32:52] <KitsuWhooa> I don't know if makepkg -A works
[09:33:09] <KitsuWhooa> but no, there's no separate AUR
[09:33:29] <horo> is pkgbild the package name?
[09:33:50] <KitsuWhooa> PKGBUILD is the file in the package that tells makepkg how to build the package
[09:35:24] <KitsuWhooa> You should probably read https://wiki.archlinux.org
[09:35:24] <phrik> Title: Arch User Repository - ArchWiki (at wiki.archlinux.org)
[09:36:01] <horo> thank you
[09:36:50] <horo> so i would get the 64bit version from AUR, edit the pkgbuild, run makepkg than pacman -U and pray it all works?
[09:36:55] <KitsuWhooa> yup
[09:37:23] <KitsuWhooa> just a matter of adding 'pentium4' or 'i686' in the arch=() array
[09:37:43] <horo> ok I'll investigate that
[09:38:27] <horo> i had tried a copy of fbterm from git, but trying to run ./configure throws an error that it can't find configure.guess
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[10:04:46] <buildmaster> Hi abaumann!
[10:04:46] <buildmaster> !rq abaumann
[10:04:47] <phrik> buildmaster: <abaumann> again. I'm in favour of a database which is not dropping its pants..
[10:05:53] <abaumann> Just dropping in :-)
[10:06:00] <abaumann> On the AUR there is an article in the wiki: https://bbs.archlinux32.org
[10:06:02] <phrik> Title: Building packages from the AUR / Building / Arch Linux 32 Forum (at bbs.archlinux32.org)
[10:06:53] <abaumann> mmh, the IRC log is ahead of time?
[10:08:01] <abaumann> https://mirror.archlinux32.org
[10:08:18] <abaumann> I'm currently experimenting with a new build of ISOs based on a much newer version of mkarchiso
[10:08:41] <abaumann> For those who want to test (and thus serve as guinea pigs) ;-)
[10:12:18] <horo> thanks for the AUR link
[10:16:16] <abaumann> np
[10:18:00] <abaumann> fbterm, usually when you check out from git you have to first generate the autoconf stuff, there is usually a script for this.. autoreconf or so.
[10:19:20] <abaumann> configure: error: cannot find required auxiliary files: config.guess config.sub
[10:19:23] <abaumann> ah, yes.
[10:19:36] <horo> is the autoconfig stuff what happens when i run ./configure ?
[10:19:41] <abaumann> no.
[10:19:48] <abaumann> usually it has to be done by the author..
[10:20:00] <abaumann> fbterm seems a little bit broken around that corner :-)
[10:20:17] <KitsuWhooa> I don't know much about autoconf, so when configure errors out or doesn't exist, there's usuall an autogen.sh
[10:20:18] <abaumann> autoreconf -i
[10:20:21] <KitsuWhooa> but there doesn't seem to be on here either
[10:20:37] <KitsuWhooa> either way, the AUR package for fbterm has patches, so it's probably easier to just use that :p
[10:20:47] <abaumann> true that.
[10:20:57] <abaumann> vterm_states.cpp:43:1: error: narrowing conversion of ‘-1’ from ‘int’ to ‘u16’ {aka ‘short unsigned int’} [-Wnarrowing]
[10:20:58] <horo> ok i'll try that method next
[10:21:00] <abaumann> yeah.
[10:21:01] <KitsuWhooa> s/on/one/
[10:21:11] <abaumann> the git version is a little bit broken.
[10:22:36] <abaumann> the AUR version has armv7h in arch, so somebody already tested and fixed it for 32-bit ARM, which makes it much more likely it works on IA-32
[10:23:08] <horo> is the ./configure error something not setup right on my system? i located configure.guess and configure.sub so i know i have them
[10:23:45] <abaumann> no, this is a problem with the package not being correctly autoconfed or/and it has been autoconfed with a very old version of the autotools.
[10:24:31] <abaumann> autoconf is more or less self-contained.
[10:24:44] <abaumann> and if autotools are broken on the system we are the first ones to notice..
[10:24:51] <abaumann> ..because half of the software stops building :-)
[10:25:14] <horo> that's good to know. I'm new to being this deep into the system with arch
[10:26:38] <KitsuWhooa> I should buy this book at some point https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com :p
[10:27:06] <abaumann> this one you have to get from a museum very soon :-)
[10:27:21] <KitsuWhooa> >1 Used from $286.99
[10:27:23] <KitsuWhooa> thanks Amazon
[10:27:46] <abaumann> I see more and more half-assed together meson or cmake scripts only supporting half the things the old autotools configure.ac supported.
[10:28:11] <KitsuWhooa> doesn't make autotools any better :p
[10:28:33] <abaumann> yeah, I'm also not a particular fan of writting macros in M4.. :-)
[10:29:03] <abaumann> but at least there was a good convention how a package should appear to the one compiling it. configure/make/make install
[10:29:08] <abaumann> DESTDIR actually works.
[10:29:09] <abaumann> and so on.
[10:29:24] <KitsuWhooa> you forgot autogen :p
[10:29:24] <abaumann> In new tools everything is always different and some things are simply broken.
[10:29:30] * abaumann shudders
[10:29:31] <KitsuWhooa> eh
[10:30:04] <abaumann> I know a 25 years old software where I insisted to use autotools.. it still builds just fine 25 years after..
[10:30:24] <abaumann> so, at least autotools have proven that they work over some period of time.
[10:30:31] <KitsuWhooa> I feel like cmake does as well
[10:30:57] <abaumann> cmake has a terrible syntax and no central repository for cmakeish things..
[10:31:17] <abaumann> ..so everybody starts to write detection scripts, one worse than the other.
[10:31:18] <KitsuWhooa> While I agree, I found it "usable" :p
[10:31:33] <abaumann> It's very ok as long as you stick to simple things.
[10:31:38] <abaumann> Build a library, build a binary.
[10:31:46] <abaumann> Don't do funny script-like detection
[10:32:03] <abaumann> it makes life much easier for the 80% case, I agree.
[10:32:23] <KitsuWhooa> I do want to try using meson at some point
[10:32:28] <KitsuWhooa> using as in, writing something with it
[10:32:35] <abaumann> terrible things happen, if you want to probe for intrinsics or compiler options, do cross-compilation and so..
[10:32:36] <KitsuWhooa> meson .. && ninja works pretty well :p
[10:32:48] <abaumann> ninja is actually quite neat.
[10:32:50] <abaumann> small.
[10:32:55] <abaumann> meson is a big mess in python.
[10:33:09] <abaumann> Experienced last when python 3.10 broke and I had to break tons of circles.
[10:33:20] <KitsuWhooa> Yeah, python is my worry too
[10:33:23] <KitsuWhooa> especially if you want to build on old systems
[10:34:19] <abaumann> all in all: my personal opinion is: build systems are mainly futile, just have compilers do more.
[10:34:39] <abaumann> most of the problems arise because the C standard doesn't incorporate modern things like SIMD and intrinsics
[10:34:51] <abaumann> dependencies: the compiler knows best.
[10:35:12] <abaumann> for bootstrapping I lately prefer just simple shell scripts, just the calls to the tools.
[10:35:17] <abaumann> no dependencies, no nothing.
[10:35:45] <abaumann> I also had an experimental package builder based on ninja.
[10:35:53] <abaumann> Generating the rules from depends,makedepends etc.
[10:35:57] <abaumann> this is actually quite neat.
[10:37:03] <abaumann> "fbterm: stdin isn't a interactive tty!", well, good look with that. :-)
[10:37:43] <horo> what will that mean for usage?
[10:38:23] <abaumann> no clue. but I suppose it really only works in a framebuffer environment.
[10:38:34] <abaumann> but it builds from the AUR on pentium4
[10:38:39] <horo> will i not be able to pipe stdin to other applications?
[10:39:01] <abaumann> no clue, I know just xterm and sometimes st.
[10:39:10] <abaumann> I'm not using other terminals..
[10:39:29] <KitsuWhooa> I thought you're supposed to use it in a tty
[10:39:31] <KitsuWhooa> :p
[10:39:39] <KitsuWhooa> isn't that why it's called "fb" term? :p
[10:39:48] * abaumann shrugs
[10:40:09] <abaumann> I don't quite understand the code there doing strchr's with /dev/tty and /dev/bc
[10:40:11] <horo> i currently don't have X server and wanted to try it for inhanced graphics
[10:40:12] <abaumann> */dev/vc
[10:40:20] <KitsuWhooa> Yeah, it should work just fine for that
[10:40:21] <abaumann> ah.
[10:41:07] <abaumann> oh: "make[1]: *** [utils/haddock/ghc.mk:20: utils/haddock/dist/build/Haddock/Syb.dyn_o] Segmentation fault (core dumped)
[10:41:14] <abaumann> my bootstrapped haskell segfaulted again.
[10:41:15] <horo> my project laptop is slightly more powerful than a potatoe, so i'm trying to keep it very lean
[10:41:24] <abaumann> I'm slowly loosing hope there..
[10:43:43] <abaumann> Haskell has tons of micro-dependencies, a funny way of checksumming the packages and a not so simple bootstrapping mechanism.
[10:43:53] <abaumann> And this just for pandoc and shellcheck to be packaged?
[10:50:18] <abaumann> mmh. xnomad, well, yeah, that's sort of an important user of Haskell..
[10:52:55] <horo> night all, thanks again for the info. very helpfull
[10:53:08] <abaumann> bye, np :-)
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[14:11:21] <buildmaster> Hi abaumann!
[14:11:21] <buildmaster> !rq abaumann
[14:11:21] <phrik> buildmaster: <abaumann> it's not my work. slaves are supposed to do brainless work. ;-)
[14:11:27] <abaumann> what is "archbuild32@butler"?
[14:11:40] <abaumann> I see build failures from an (to me) unknown build machine.
[14:15:55] <abaumann> it's also a machine generating constantly build errors of the sort " is corrupted (invalid or corrupted packa
[14:15:58] <abaumann> ge (PGP signature))."
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[19:03:19] <ripur> test test
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